Posts tagged w/ Grammar

About the Mammas and the Pappas - in Polish

Posted by Anna Ikeda

The other day I was discussing motherhood with one of my friends. No, I am not planning to have a baby, I have two cats and I’m quite happy with them for the time being. However, my friend has a baby and we were going over the joys and perils of motherhood and the problems of fatherhood. And then we started to marvel at just how gloriously illogical this language of ours is.

Because take a look at this:

Motherhood is “macierzyństwo”. But fatherhood is not “tacierzyństwo” but “ojcostwo”.
Maternity leave is “urlop macierzyński”. And what about paternity leave? Until very recently there wasn’t even such animal in Poland. But now that there is (and will be officially official at all places of employment beginning next year for all new fathers who want to take advantage of it) what do we call it in Polish? Urlop tacierzyński.

But that’s not all. That’s just the beginning of problems with dads.
Ok, mom and dad are two of the first words that a child learns, or so I hear. In Polish those words are easy: mama and tata.

You’d think that it must be pretty hard to screw up something to easy and so basic that every Pole older than 9 months knows it, right? Wrong! Because in reality it’s not that easy, trust me.

While the plural of “mama” is of course “mamy” – every child knows that, what is the plural of “tata”? Automatically, we wanted to say “taty”. We even called a friendly elementary school teacher to see what she had to say. How does she tell the kids to ask their moms and dads to come to the meeting, for example? She tried to cheat and said: “mamy i ojcowie” (moms and fathers).

But how do you say “dads” in plural without cheating and using “fathers” instead? Does “tata” even have a plural form? Yes, it (he? LOL) does.

The correct plural of “tata” is “tatowie”. I know, you don’t have to tell me. I don’t see any logic in it either. The plural of “mama” is “mamy” but the plural of “tata” is “tatowie”. Apparently, that noun follows the same pattern as “dziadek – dziadkowie” (grandfather – grandfathers) and “wujek – wujkowie” (uncle – uncles). Yes, but those masculine nouns don’t end in “a”. And those masculine nouns that do end in “a”, such as kierowca (driver) or doradca (advisor) have plural forms eerily resembling those of “mamy” – kierowcy (drivers) and doradcy (advisors).

So, let’s review:

  • mama (feminine) – mamy (feminine, plural)

but

  • tata (masculine) – tatowie (masculine, plural)
  • urlop macierzyński – maternity leave

but

  • urlop tacierzyński – paternity leave

but

  • ojcostwo – fatherhood (also paternity), oddly enough, grammatically this noun is neuter in gender.

but

  • macierzyństwo – motherhood (also grammatically neuter)

And those are just the linguistic problems, we’re not even talking about smelly diapers here!

 

Polish Present Tense

Posted by Anna Ikeda

Of course, since last time I bravely announced that the next post would be about grammar, I put on my procrastinator’s hat and have been doing everything possible to put it off for as long as possible. But then today my friend said “you’re stupid, the sooner you explain this grammar stuff, the sooner you can devote your time to more interesting things – like visiting me, for example.” And then she went on and actually did the grammar explaining as well:

“It’s really simple, OK? In English they have this whole bunch of useless tenses, the one with ‘do you blah blah’ and the one with ‘ing something something’ and then the one with ‘been ing whatever, anyway you know it and besides who cares? All your people really need to know that in Polish all this nonsense turns into one normal present tense, just how gods intended it to be in the first place. End of grammar lesson, now, when do you come visit me? I kup jakieś ciasto po drodze, OK? (and buy some cake on your way)”

(Now, if all Polish teachers could be like that! Wow!)

Unfortunately, I’m sure that now “my people” are staring at their computer screens and thinking “come again? ing blah something whatever? huh?”

So, let’s go over it again. And this time let’s use a handy example. How about the one from the previous post, the one about “Ja uczę się polskiego”?

In English you can say the following things:

  • I study Polish.
  • I’m studying Polish.

and

  • I’ve been studying Polish.

And yes, “uczyć się” can be translated into English as both “to learn” and “to study” and don’t listen to Poles telling you otherwise.
In Polish the verb “studiować” (to study) is used almost exclusively when referring to higher education, as in “I studied psychology at Harvard.” - Studiowałam psychologię na Harvardzie. (no, not really, I’m not that ambitious.)


But a sentence such as: “I’ve been studying Polish for two years” can be translated into Polish as “Uczę się (języka) polskiego od dwóch lat.” So for today, we’ll stick with “to study – uczyć się”, OK?

And see what happened above?

The “been ing whatever” (I’ve been studying Polish by myself) became simply “Uczę się polskiego od dwóch lat” in Polish.

By the way, here’s a little something worth remembering. In English we say “for two years” while the Polish equivalent is “od dwóch lat”, which when translated back to English means “since two years.” Which explains why plenty of Poles say it like that when speaking English.

And how about “I study Polish when I have time.”?
Uczę się polskiego kiedy mam czas.

See, again just a regular present tense in Polish. Nothing fancy.

So how about “I’m studying Polish, be quiet.”?
Uczę się polskiego, bądź cicho.


And again the “ing something something” became the same old boring present tense in Polish.

And voila! My friend was absolutely correct. And it only took her 15 seconds to explain this issue. Man, I have a lot to learn… Now, what kind of cake should I buy? I’m thinking “drożdżowka” (yeast cake).

 

Polski via Skype - Learning Polish via Skype?

Posted by Anna Ikeda

Thank you once again! I’m sure that your answers to my question in the last post are going to be very helpful to any readers who are still not sure whether to sign up for a Polish language class or go it alone. And as a few of you noticed, sometimes there’s no choice – it’s self-study or nothing, because Polish classes can be hard to find in some places.

That brings me to another point I’d like to know your opinion about. What do you think about the effectiveness of learning via Skype with a tutor? A couple of you mentioned this way of studying Polish and this is something I’d like to know more about from the student’s point of view.

You see, I am myself helping a couple of Polish learners via Skype and from where I’m sitting, it looks like a wonderful way to study a foreign language. It can be a quasi-language course, and a quasi-private class with all the convenience of doing it in your pajamas.

But how effective is it, really? Do you think that it can replace a structured “in-person” language course and offer the same learning benefit? To be honest, this is something I’m not sure about, and as a tutor I may be shooting myself in the foot here, but I have to say that Skype is not for everybody. It requires the same discipline and dedication as independent self-study. And it requires more concentration and attention than working one-on-one with a tutor face-to-face – for both the teacher AND the student. Myself, I find it more challenging than working with a student in real life.

But those of you who use this option, do you think you get out of it what you want to get? Are you happy with your results and the progress you are making? And how do you deal with the time difference if you and the tutor live in different time zones? Who stays up? Is it you or the teacher? Do you think this method can be used alone, or is it best in conjunction with something else?

I think Polish is a very challenging language to teach via Skype. A simple conversation lesson about, let’s say, ordering beer, almost always ends up as a very involved grammatical explanation of, let’s say, noun cases or numerals. However, what I think might be vastly different from what you guys think.

I know that quite a few Polish tutors read this blog, and I know your answers will be very valuable not only to me, but to anyone who teaches a foreign language on the internet. And that in turn should bring better results to our students.

  • uczyć się polskiego – to learn Polish
  • uczyć się – to learn

Remember when we talked about “się” and how it can change the meaning of a verb completely?
Here’s your chance to review:

  • Ja uczę polskiego. – I (am) teach(ing) Polish (“language” is implied and understood). – This is what I would say about myself.

But:

  • Ja uczę się polskiego. – I (am) learn(ing) Polish (“language” is implied and understood) – this is what you could say about yourself.

But if you want to direct the first sentence to me, what would you say?

  • Ty uczysz polskiego. – You (are) teach(ing) Polish.

And if I want to direct the second sentence to you, what would I say?

  • Ty uczysz się polskiego. – You (are) learn(ing) Polish.

Ok, next time we will take a look at the many different English tenses this one Polish sentence can be translated into. Yes, it’s grammar time! Oh joy, oh joy!

 

Polish Language Course or Self-Study?

Posted by Anna Ikeda

It’s official! I have the best readers in the world here. And this is no exaggeration. Your comments make my life so much easier. Not to mention – making my blog posts easier, too.

I wanted to thank all of you for taking the time to comment. Sometimes your comments are very extensive and contain more grammatical information than I’m willing to look for and provide. You know that I’m not fond of grammar. And teaching grammar is something that I always avoid, regardless of the language involved. That’s why I appreciate every single comment and explanation you provide.

I am very fortunate to have readers like you. And I am even more fortunate to have fabulous readers who are native Polish speakers as well. Poles, by and large, are very proud of their language’s grammar and like to demonstrate their expertise in this tough subject whenever possible. I am a very pitiful exception to this rule.

This became painfully apparent during my flight from Tokyo to Copenhagen yesterday. I was seated next to a young Japanese girl who lives in Ireland and has a Polish boyfriend there. Hi Kaori!!!

She is busy learning Polish in order to be able to communicate with her boyfriend’s family, who don’t speak English. Kaori is not attending any courses and is doing it entirely as a self-study program using her boyfriend and “Teach Yourself Polish”. And while she gets a lot of help from her guy, she says that this incomprehensible grammar of ours trips both of them up nearly every time.

So, here’s my question to you. How do you learn the language? Do you study alone? Or do you think that attending a Polish language course is a better option?

Personally, I firmly believe that a language course is indispensable. I wouldn’t attempt to learn a foreign language by myself. I know it’s not for me, because I’ve tried and failed miserably. The discipline is just not there.

I’d like to make a list of Polish language classes and courses for individual students (not university programs) all over the world. Yes, I know such a list would need to be constantly updated, but I am willing to give it a try. I think it would provide a great resource for those of us who want to learn Polish but need that extra help of a trained instructor. Because our amazing commenters and readers can only get us so far.

There are plenty of Polish language classes for foreigners in Poland, but what about those who want to learn our beautiful (if a bit incomprehensible) language in other countries? Any particular classes you’d like to recommend? In the coming days I’ll be calling to different places and trying to gather information. But in the meantime, if there are any classes/courses you are familiar with, please share the details with us! Thank you!

  • kurs językowy – language course (in general)
  • kurs języka polskiego – Polish language course
  • kurs (noun, masculine, plural: kursy) - course
 

Gender and Occupations, continued…

Posted by Anna Ikeda

Remember when I mentioned that the EU head honchos in Brussels want us to stop using gender specific names for professions? I also said that it was something I agreed with.

Wow! I never thought that that particular post would provoke so many emails. Both for and against.

But you see, we already have many nouns for occupations and professions that are gender–neutral. Or at least they are now, because the same form is used by both men and women.

I have a friend, a female friend, who works on a cargo vessel. She refers to herself as “marynarz” (sailor). Another young woman I know lists her job as “pilot”. And I don’t mean here a tour guide (known in Polish as “pilot wycieczek”), she is a real pilot flying planes for a shipping company.

To that, we can add tons of other women, who can say they are:

  • inżynier – engineer
  • oficer - officer
  • kierowca - driver
  • lekarz - doctor - even though, there is a female form – “lekarka” most women doctors I spoke to agreed they preferred the masculine version - “lekarz
  • weterynarz - veterinarian
  • architekt - architect
  • strażak – fire fighter
  • redaktor - editor - same as with doctors, ladies who do this job, refer to themselves using the male term – “redaktor” and when necessary add “naczelna” making “redaktor naczelna” if they are editors-in-chief. (I actually called several magazines to ask their editors about it.)

Why do they prefer the male noun? For exactly the same reason that Russ mentioned in his comment to the previous post on this subject.
Take the word “autor” for example. It means “writer” or “author” or “male writer” or “male author.”
Autorka”, on the other hand, makes it very clear we are talking about a female.

So if I say that “Moja ulubiona polska autorka to Joanna Chmielewska” does it mean that Joanna Chmielewska is my favorite Polish female writer? Or my favorite Polish writer in general? Or should I rather say that “Mój ulubiony polski autor to Joanna Chmielewska”?

Why do I have to distinguish if my favorite writer is male or female? If I were talking about Bharati Mukherjee for example, we wouldn’t have this problem, simply because most people wouldn’t know anyway. Then why do we do it in Polish? Personally, I would say that “Mój ulubiony polski autor to Joanna Chmielewska”, because I prefer her humorous crime stories to other books by Polish authors, be it male or female. (What can I say? I’m not really into heavy-duty literature. Pity Ms. Chmielewska’s books have not been translated into English yet.)

And then, what do we do with those occupations that have been performed by females for so long that we don’t even think about how they would sound in their male versions? Or if they even have masculine forms at all.

In English it’s simple. A nurse is a nurse, regardless of his/her gender. In Polish, a nurse is definitely female, almost by default – pielęgniarka.
The male form – pielęgniarz just sounds awkward and stiff. I had a hard time finding a male nurse in Poland, but when I finally did, and we chatted on skype last week, I asked him what he preferred to be called.

He said, “you know what Anna, either word is fine, heck, any word is fine, as long as the old ladies in my care would finally accept me as a fully qualified, competent nurse. But still… it must be even worse to be a male kindergarten teacher…”

And yeah, he had a point. Female kindergarten teachers are “przedszkolanki” (singular: przedszkolanka). What on earth do you call a guy? Definitely not “przedszkolak” (kindergartener). :)

PS. The male nurse said that most of the time, everybody, his patients and female co-workers call him “rodzynek” (raisin), meaning he’s the only one of his kind.